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General Category => Huh? => Topic started by: skeezix on May 08, 2017, 2319 UTC
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http://38north.org/2017/05/jliu050517/
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That's a pleasant thought but some say otherwise;
http://www.wnd.com/2016/04/emp-alert-2-n-korean-satellites-now-orbit-over-u-s/
http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/expert-north-koreas-h-bomb-is-super-emp-weapon/article/2579715
http://glitch.news/2016-01-12-north-korea-is-orbiting-a-satellite-over-the-usa-in-the-precise-position-to-launch-a-nation-killing-emp-weapon-from-space.html
http://www.n2yo.com/?s=39026
The NK sats haven't emitted a peep since launch and are at the perfect altitude for a textbook emp pop. There's also the rumour that NK bought super emp tech from Russia and China.
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Fire up HAARP, Al. The sky is falling... again.
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http://www.wnd.com is not exactly... reliable ;D
I would not be surprised if the US/Russia/China have undeclared orbiting nuclear weapons for EMP purposes (even though it violates treaties), but this is a bit beyond NK's capabilities at present.
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It's pretty simple. The effectiveness of the EMP directly correlates to the size of the weapon, as demonstrated in the article Skeezix linked. and there's no evidence that any of North Korea's weapons is any bigger than Little Boy. (The quoted figure was 20 kT yield.) That's not too surprising; it takes an enormous industrial effort to produce even small amounts of enriched uranium or plutonium.
That's also why, even if Pakistan helped NK develop their program, they're probably not just going to give them any nuclear material, or sell it at a specially reduced price.
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Imagine how it would profit Russia and China for NK to do their dirty work for them. Hence why I feel enhanced emp stuffs were sold/loaned/given to NK.
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http://www.wnd.com is not exactly... reliable ;D
I would not be surprised if the US/Russia/China have undeclared orbiting nuclear weapons for EMP purposes (even though it violates treaties), but this is a bit beyond NK's capabilities at present.
Wasn't there a James Bond film with that being a major part of the plot?
Josh makes an interesting point re: Russia/China "hiring" North Korea/DPRK to do their dirty work for them, but I don't think NK would do such a thing.
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Imagine how it would profit Russia and China for NK to do their dirty work for them. Hence why I feel enhanced emp stuffs were sold/loaned/given to NK.
They don't have a relationship like that. China resents NK and Russia hasn't done them any favors since the Soviet Union ended. Having a nuclear NK is no help to China.
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Imagine how it would profit Russia and China for NK to do their dirty work for them. Hence why I feel enhanced emp stuffs were sold/loaned/given to NK.
They don't have a relationship like that. China resents NK and Russia hasn't done them any favors since the Soviet Union ended. Having a nuclear NK is no help to China.
Why do you think their end goal is peace and prosperity? You're talking about communists, people who actually believe communism works and kill people to prove it every day.
It's not like both of them have icbms pointed at us or anything, or that China just fabricated some islands on wich to plop military aircraft and missile defenses. NK doesn't poop without asking China first. It seems to me their end goal is to remove the threat America represents to their world hegemony. It amazes me that there are people who think the "leaders" of this world just want peace and light.
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Who said I said that?
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The worse thing that NK could do to anyone is to have Fat Boy 'un' let a big cheese phart and cause all of those Russian tanks on NK north border (Just moved there BTW) fire all at once and set NK alight in a massive blaze of 'un's fat cheese butt...
I'd much rather worry about something 'real'... like the Sun going Nova because it is vibrating from all of the crappy music being played on IPHart radio... whatever that is...
Besides... On a minutes notice we can put in place super audio gear in space and pound the hell out of NK with Yoko Ono tunage...! We have the edge...
Oh yeah... nuke caca doodee poopoo carries on the wind and I know which way the wind is blowing...
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The NK sats haven't emitted a peep since launch and are at the perfect altitude for a textbook emp pop. There's also the rumour that NK bought super emp tech from Russia and China.
It is arguable if they are at the perfect altitude, they are around 500 km alt (varies +/- about 30 km). The perfect altitude must be matched with the technology of the device used, what is the "perfect" alt for one sized device is not so much for a different sized device.
Now 320 miles is a really nice zone for EMP, assuming you have a device of correct yield. A large enough one at that alt would have a footprint covering much of the contiguous US. However a relatively low yield device, say on the order of 10x the size NK has yet actually detonated, would actually be hampered at that altitude, and would have a more effective footprint (not larger, but higher intensity) at a good bit lower alt.
Would Russia or China sell NK a tailored EMP device in the 1 MT or larger range? This is not 1991, Russia is not that hard up for hard currency.
As I type this KMS 3-2 just passed over the Russian heartland. Its next two orbits will take it over China. Such a weapon could easily be used by NK against China or Russia, and there would be nothing those nations could do to stop it. Providing a tailored EMP device small enough to fit on an NK rocket would be as dangerous to China or Russia as it would be to us. ANd NK has demonstrated that it will not be controlled by external nations.
Could NK have built a 1 MT or larger device themselves? Nothing they have done so far, no test, indicates they are anywhere near ready for that. And if they can, after the limited success they have had so far, could it fit on a sat they could lift to orbit? The KMS 3-2 is 1.6 meters, by 0.6 meters, by 0.7 meters, and is estimated to weigh about 100 kg. That has to hold whatever they want it to hold (such as a weapon) and all the TM and control stuff. We could build one to fit in that footprint, but we could not for the first 15 or so years of the most ambitious and public nuclear weapons development program seen so far. It took us about 7 years, and more than 30 successful tests, after our first test to get to our first multi-stage device, and more than 1 MT. And that device would hardly fit in a delivery truck, let alone a 100 kG payload rocket.
I see no indication, at all, that NK is at about the same level of weapons development as the US was at in 1960. They have had 5 tests, one fizzle at about 0.7 kt, the next 4 ranged from about 5 to about 25 kt. It was claimed, by NK, that the last one was of a correct size to be mounted on a missile / rocket. At the time of that test both the KMS 3-2 and the KMS 4 were already in orbit. Their demonstrated weapons tech as of the last launch was on the order of 20 kt.
At the altitude of the KMS birds 20 kt, or even several times that, is just about a firecracker.
Am I worried that they will get there? You bet, if not stopped or if they don't change their mind it is almost assured they will. But not yet, and probably not for a few more years. I think they need to pop a right size weapon in test before I start worrying about them maybe getting one to orbit.
T!
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The worse thing that NK could do to anyone is to have Fat Boy 'un' let a big cheese phart and cause all of those Russian tanks on NK north border (Just moved there BTW) fire all at once
Hell, they could use cruise missles launched from the destroyers in Vladivostok as cover, roll down and snatch Little Kim, and be back across the border with him and his Pappy's unicorn collection by dinner time.
Of course, it could go the way of that "volunteer" led invasion of Ukraine and piss out 20 miles in. "Vladimirich, I bring you a turnip that has seen the smokestacks of Donetsk looming in the distance!" "Thank you, Yuri. Have you ever been to sunny Syria?"
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Speaking of Vladivostok, the DPRK recently launch a missile and it landed about 60 mi from there. At least that's what has been reported...
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Speaking of Vladivostok, the DPRK recently launch a missile and it landed about 60 mi from there. At least that's what has been reported...
That was the previous launch, this last one landed in Japan's 200 mile economic zone. I still have a hard time believing Pyong Pyang takes a shit without Peking saying poop first.
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I really recommend "The Real North Korea" by Andrei Lankov. He's a professor of Korean history who actually got to study at Kim Il Sung university as an exchange student, and knows the country as well as any non-North Korean alive.
But keep something in mind. If China were controlling North Korea, it would be much more sensible to establish their own base with their own nukes (or, at most, just give the North the nukes but keep all the proprietary information to themselves) than allow them to develop an independent program.
North Korea has been much more of a necessity for the Chinese than an ally or a puppet. If they were the latter, they should have followed the same economic reform path China's been treading for nearly 40 years now, instead of the world's last Stalinist state and the only communist nation to have a hereditary line of succession (although we'll see what happens in Cuba when Raoul finally kicks it).
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That's assuming Peking doesn't want Pyong Pyang to do its dirty work.
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Given the lack of evidence, it's the only reasonable conclusion.
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Given the lack of evidence, it's the only reasonable conclusion.
You mean the lack of evidence for China reining in NK nuclear ambitions when China is the NK lifeline? I agree it's the only rational conclusion.
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That's the evidence that NK isn't their puppet.
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I wonder how far those rockets could deploy penguins?