HFU HF Underground
General Category => General Radio Discussion => Topic started by: Kai on October 20, 2022, 0747 UTC
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Hi Shortwave_listener
I just wanted to say that I’ve been enjoying your logs of Russian/Ukrainian and Indonesian music pirates over the past months. I love the mystique surrounding these stations! (Why do they broadcast? Do they have listeners?)
I logged and IDed quite a few 3MHz hooligans (both music stations and QSOers) around 2010 with the help of Alex (ULX2) in Kyiv. Most of the hooligans I heard were from oblasts in the west of Russia and the east of Ukraine. (They usually gave out the name of a big city, but I suspect most of them were actually located in more rural areas.)
I agree that the music stations in the 1600–1650/1700 kHz range are different from the 'QSO hooligans' on 1.7 and 3MHz. I suppose they fall into the category of 'organ grinders' (шарманщиков) (low-powered stations broadcasting to a local audience). The term for high-powered QSO stations seems to have been дальнобойщиков – 'truckers'. (I suppose you’ve read the same articles as I via Google Translate.)
I did a bit of listening to these stations in January and February this year via the Kiwi SDR in Tambov. I only listened during local daytime in Tambov, and there were usually one or two (weak or strong) stations on. I guess the fact that these stations were audible via this SDR during local daytime says something about where these stations are generally located.
The Russian/Ukrainian music stations on 1.6MHz seem to have been more or less unknown to Western DXers until around 2006. At least I don’t remember hearing about them before Harri Kujala began listening to them in late 2006:
http://www.harriku.com/russia.htm
https://hkdx2.blogspot.com/2008/02/weekend-16-1722008-russian-pirates.html
73
Kai in Oslo
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Thank you very much for your support! It is great to to some ideas from another person (Kris has also been extremely helpful informing me about Russian/Ukrainian stations). I have also wondered who these stations broadcast to, I agree it is probably a local audience. It amazes me that we know these stations have been around so long and yet no DXers ever report hearing them. It seems many are audible in Finland, but the listeners there never log them. I had totally forgot about the шарманщиков, that is probably who these stations are! I can’t seem to find much by googling that term, but what I do know seems to be consistent with these stations. I wonder how many listeners they actually have? Is it just a few people, or is there actually a large local audience for these stations? I am currently listening on the Tambov receiver now and reception of many stations is good. That receiver only has a 10 meter long vertical antenna so the signals must be very strong there (they sound better there than on the Finnish receivers with hundreds of meters of wire). I wonder what kind of power and antennas they use?
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Yes, who knows, perhaps they have an audience of some kind. At least I suppose they listen to each other.
I'm not sure how common the term Шарманщик/sharmanshchik (plural: sharmanshchikov/шарманщиков) is. But I've seen it here and there. I have no idea if these stations would call themselves that. :)
Good to see that many of them play a lot of Vladimir Vysotsky, but the way! A great singer-songwriter!
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I don't know about those stations in or around Russia,
but those above 1620 or 1630 kHz surely can't get many listeners.
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I don't know about those stations in or around Russia,
but those above 1620 or 1630 kHz surely can't get many listeners.
Good point, I forgot nearly all European mediumwave receivers stop at 1611 kHz. As Kai said, i imagine they at least listen to each other. Maybe, if they have no contact information they simply broadcast because there could be an audience, without knowing for sure there is one? Seems unlikely though, I doubt they would continue to operate if they have no idea if they have even one listener. I have listened to the Greek/Serbian/Dutch mediumwave pirates and it seems their audience is each other.
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The topic is developing in an interesting way. Lucas- thanks for mentioning me!
Here are some of my words to explain where the шарманкa came from. In ancient Russia, there were wandering musicians playing lyre-like, instruments made by themselves and romantically called шарманкa . This name was adopted by Russian radio amateurs, who called it their home-built transmitter.
"шарманщик" is even a nice apt description of such broadcasters, instead of the pejorative name "radiochulign" coined by the authorities.
They say "I work on шарманкa " but I have not heard him say "I am a шарманщик".
The fact is that perhaps half of the Russian population is related to the military, and it is easier to "fix"
a decommissioned transmitter there than to buy a Western-made TRX (legal barriers and prohibitive dollar prices for them). Romantic, free broadcasters, young people and grandpapas, who pursue their radio passions beyond shortwave licenses, work on such often dilapidated equipment. It is the authorities who call them "radio-hooligans", and they call themselves "svobodnyj", "свободный" means freedom.
The first transmitters were built on television lamps, because only this was available in Russian stores. The obtained power of about 10W allowed for reception in the area of several streets and such a young constructor had a group of his listeners in the district where he lived. They listened to their favorite music and talked about their equipment, while the authorities hunted them with GAZ bearing cars.
Then came the transmitting lamps used by the military and HAMS from the GU ... series, which allowed to reach a power of several hundred watts. Even recently, the owner of Radio Buchta was looking for these lamps for his car HF transmitter, because they used up quickly (probably had a few kW of power).
Interesting observation about the reception range of these stations. You can hear them in the daytime in Finland on a vertical antenna, worse on long antennas. Europe does not pick them up (central and western, neither do I), even after dusk. The conclusion is obvious - these are low-power stations located in the western and central European part of Russia, from where the direct wave reaches the recipients. At night, they are lost in the multitude of reflected waves and high background levels.
I picket out the Radio Buchta Swobodnych Wołn on 1575kHz legibly during the day.
It broadcast from Belarus near the Russian border, it had to be a local transmitter with a power
of at least 10kW. A few years ago in Poland, on the initiative of local communities, a group of low power transmitters (1-10kW) was officially operating. Unfortunately, for economic reasons, they all seem to have fallen silent.
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As I said I would, I have uploaded some recordings of these stations for Kris to listen to (or anyone else of course). Please check the video description for each one, I have put the time in the video that the station operator speaks (you can click on the time to jump directly to that part of the video). Maybe you will be able to tell me what they are talking about? I will likely hear many more of these stations over the weekend and I will continue to upload more recordings.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1fwOHPxIi0&t=9s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fJAhwXQ7kIQ&t=8s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L62_eSP41Zo&t=9s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_oYtN-0awA
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Yes, this thread is getting very interesting indeed, Kris!
Thanks to you and Shortwave_listener (and the web SDRs!) we're finally getting to know the Russian music pirates a bit better. I think they will remain partly a mystery, though (I like mysteries!), because I have a feeling it will be very difficult to contact them. (But who knows, perhaps it's possible via this forum: https://6p3s.ru/forum/index.php)
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Here is what I read in the recordings (not everything is understood):
No 1: 1650v kHz 25'25 only for whom "karmak" (Kazakh?)
(this is some comment to the lyrics of the song)
49'05 ah muse, you always are, you are not sick, flowing words
1.00'15 who are urgent, I'll end this, all the best
No 2: 1628 kHz Magnit (that's his ID) finished, who was listening hello everyone
No 3: 1645 kHz Orlov Arbat, ... obtained little musical rights
No 4: 1615 kHz Magnit finished, who was listening hello everyone
- Thanks Kai for the last link to the Russian Free Broadcaster page.
Entries start in 2007 but the forum is still open in 2022. This is an idea to get in touch with them through this forum, maybe the isolation barrier will break.
There is something to read about throughout the winter. If the google translator even twists the words, you will understand what the author meant. Even these old entries say a lot about their passion for radio, desires, fears and problems. Years pass, but not much changes there.
A simple Russian as a human will share with you his last loaf of bread and a bottle of vodka.
They have it instilled in the air that politics, religion, or sex are not talked about.
Maybe that's why Russians, Ukrainians, Georgians and Kazakhs talk to each other in the 100m band!
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Thank you very much to Kai and Kris! That website is probably our best chance at contacting a station operator. Maybe one of you wants to try, or I could register there and give it a try? Very nice that Kris was able to identify Magnit!
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Here are some more recordings I would greatly appreciate a translation of. Please check the video description for each one, I have put the times in the video that the station operator speaks (you can click on the time to jump directly to that part of the video). These are the recordings I made over the weekend. I made many more recordings (which everyone is welcome to view on my YouTube channel) but the links below are only to recordings that the station operator speaks in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JPDzLND6bIM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Slvz0eAbrRQ
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0D9ckG8B-4&t=2s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hP1ye936n7U&t=10s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=swjEnu7Yc0w
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FU_majNx7Hk
I am also trying to join the Russian forum. I have sent an email asking to join (that is the only way, no registration on the website itself) and I will inform you when I receive a reply.
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IDs for last recordings by Shortwave_listener:
No1 1634v 06'08 pozdrawlaju(greetings) Komantator Radio
No2 1710v 17'55 wsio charaszo, spasiba kto słyszał, wsem poka > all is well, thank you who heard, bye everyone
No3 1698v too noisy
No4 1662v 43'50 tak uż wsio charaszo, muzyka akoncziłaś, rabotał Pajalnik
No5 1634v 4'27 eto ja Komantator Radiostancja
09'33 powieria (believe) Komantator Radiostancja
No6 1679v 02'40 druzja diapazona Drużba (Drużba band friends) , para pesni posłuszate (it's time to listen
songs)
Drużba charaszo weczera, niebo czistoe (Drużba good evening, clear sky)
04'58 ne bałakajte, dobro pożit', dobro parjadok (don't talk, good live, good order)
Drużba c wami (Drużba with you), kak prochodiło?(How was it?)
- The content shows that this is an Ukrainian station, only "clear sky" is important to them!
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Thank you for all the translations! I have corrected all the logs and YouTube videos with the correct identification.
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Here is something that may be of interest. I looks like these stations really like to post videos of their equipment on YouTube! Below are some of the videos I have found. It also appears the QSO stations do the same thing, but I have specifically excluded their videos from this list. Maybe Kris will find something of interest in the videos, but I suspect they mostly talk about the technical aspects of their station.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Sfq9ks_Nb54
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFGUNoTo4wA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iofpscZj9Ls
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q8ymYlNUJ9Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74LZlnru_FE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noZDpcb8-hI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kH0_EPi-Wic
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adnvDGzxZFI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPV6qJD8yck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7O4dBIj60Q
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2qK3GVB1Rx4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E1JEF63TWdE
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZjiFS9hiC4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7So1oNF_Wvk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=id8r8UpRNNY
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sk7o7_Knys0
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSyoySLHsB4
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mbkkv9DT1dI
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fPH0ShoZ_9c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WfoBq_bkX4E
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This is the most popular transmitter design used by these stations (I think this is it anyway).
(https://i.ibb.co/jDc8sJN/B9-E60-CA8-C3-B3-434-C-9-E0-C-DF4-AF3-E02-C4-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/CQkwDPc)
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Interesting. Well, with all of that massive real estate that Russia has, a small community could possibly get away with a MW pirate for years. I´ll bet some Russian bands would love to be on those, since a rep from the band Master, has told me that there´s no way that rock & metal artists would be aired on gov-run AM / FM stations there. Which is why Master appreciated getting aired on Part #15 AM, LPFM, and even WBCQ, with programs like this one: https://archive.org/details/the-underground-jam-slate-no-tuj-09122021-review-of-master-master-of-time
As far as Russian to English translating goes? DeepL seems to be way better, than Google Translate: https://www.deepl.com/en/translator
Anyway... Interesting that this topic re-popped back up, since Master recently e-mailed me about their 35th anniversary from their separation from the band Aria. Nothing like timing.
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A simple Russian as a human will share with you his last loaf of bread and a bottle of vodka.
We should all be so lucky. Loving this thread, and hope to learn more as this develops :)
спасибо!
+-RH
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This is the most popular transmitter design used by these stations (I think this is it anyway).
(https://i.ibb.co/jDc8sJN/B9-E60-CA8-C3-B3-434-C-9-E0-C-DF4-AF3-E02-C4-E.jpg) (https://ibb.co/CQkwDPc)
Maybe this explain why a lot of the stations on MW drift all over the place and sound pretty rough (putting it charitably). :)
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Charlie, that was the article I ran across doing research for the old "Homebrew Pirate Radio Group". Arnie Coro had an SSB transmitter schematic based on the same type tube he flogged on Radio Havana. He said and I quote, "It might drift 40-50 kc., but it will get you on the air." Good ol' Arnie.
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You wouldn't need a VFO. Just wait for it to drift to the frequency you want. Problem solved. :)
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I think it was the same transmitter design Radio Havana used when I was a kid? When they amplified it and pointed those antenna arrays north, you could hear Fidel on one of his multi-hour rants coming out of every speaker in town.
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I still have not found any additional information :-\
I am still awaiting a reply regarding joining the 6p3s.ru forum, I am doubting it is ever going to happen. If anyone else wants to try to join, write (in Russian) to ua9uco@yandex.ru (Igor Jurtaev-UA9UCO).
Maybe this explain why a lot of the stations on MW drift all over the place and sound pretty rough (putting it charitably). :)
Would you mind explaining why that is? I would like to know, but I cannot read schematics.
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VFO's tend to drift radically based on temperature, applied voltage, circuit loading, etc. Unless great pains are exercised in construction, the drift of a conventional VFO can be significant. One of these circuits appears to be a modulated power oscillator, meaning the operating frequency would likely change based on antenna loading changes, and with modulation...poor man's FM.
It's one of the reasons I like DDS 😁
+-RH
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One of these circuits appears to be a modulated power oscillator, meaning the operating frequency would likely change based on antenna loading changes, and with modulation...poor man's FM.
Yes and I'm going to expand on this a little:
Transmitter have several operating functions inside them. Examples are, an oscillator (a VFO is one such oscillator), a final amplifier and perhaps some amplification between the two of these, perhaps some sort of power supply (e.g., 'bias") circuit. All those functions have to be present and operate well separately from each other; this implies a level of isolation and is critical for proper operation. If the different functions interfere or interact with each other too much, bad things can happen like muddy/mushy modulation, FMing or frequency shifting with modulation, oscillator drift, feedback (instability), operation at unintended frequencies and so on.
The best way to ensure a certain amount of isolation is to make separate oscillator circuit, a separate final amplifier circuit, separate power supply circuit and then the designer will weave them together so that they all "play nicely" with each other.
The single tube/valve transmitter shown doesn't have any of that isolation between circuit functions; it does all the functions in one circuit and so it is prone all the issues I mentioned above. So why do it? Having those functions in separate circuits adds complexity, expense and time to build. For a hobbyist, convenience may override all those other considerations.
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One of these circuits appears to be a modulated power oscillator, meaning the operating frequency would likely change based on antenna loading changes, and with modulation...poor man's FM.
Yes and I'm going to expand on this a little:
Transmitter have several operating functions inside them. Examples are, an oscillator (a VFO is one such oscillator), a final amplifier and perhaps some amplification between the two of these, perhaps some sort of power supply (e.g., 'bias") circuit. All those functions have to be present and operate well separately from each other; this implies a level of isolation and is critical for proper operation. If the different functions interfere or interact with each other too much, bad things can happen like muddy/mushy modulation, FMing or frequency shifting with modulation, oscillator drift, feedback (instability), operation at unintended frequencies and so on.
The best way to ensure a certain amount of isolation is to make separate oscillator circuit, a separate final amplifier circuit, separate power supply circuit and then the designer will weave them together so that they all "play nicely" with each other.
The single tube/valve transmitter shown doesn't have any of that isolation between circuit functions; it does all the functions in one circuit and so it is prone all the issues I mentioned above. So why do it? Having those functions in separate circuits adds complexity, expense and time to build. For a hobbyist, convenience may override all those other considerations.
Yes, this precisely.
+-RH
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When I ran across that schematic in the first decade of the century, there was an article with it that mentioned the one tube design was due to the fact that parts were hard to get. An ordinary citizen had to apply for a permit to buy a TV or radio and it took months and up to a year's salary to buy one. The pirates used tubes scrounged from scrapped TV's and radio's they found in the trash and preferred triodes.
Arnie Coro in his talk about his drifty SSB transmitter on "Dx'ers Unlimited" mentioned using tubes from those same type of Eastern Bloc TV's and radio's to build it. They were common junk in post Cold War Cuba.
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When I ran across that schematic in the first decade of the century, there was an article with it that mentioned the one tube design was due to the fact that parts were hard to get. An ordinary citizen had to apply for a permit to buy a TV or radio and it took months and up to a year's salary to buy one. The pirates used tubes scrounged from scrapped TV's and radio's they found in the trash and preferred triodes.
Yes, I remember hearing this more than once. That's all they could get, so something simple is understandable.
Arnie Coro in his talk about his drifty SSB transmitter on "Dx'ers Unlimited" mentioned using tubes from those same type of Eastern Bloc TV's and radio's to build it. They were common junk in post Cold War Cuba.
I always wonder about the reasonable number of Cuban hams on FT8. I'm visualizing a bunch of hams using 20-year old computers that can barely keep up with the demands of WSJT-X, like the 1950s Edsel cars in videos of Havana. At the same time, their computer clocks don't seem any more out of sync with accurate UTC time than the US hams so...
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There was a man down the street from one of Great-Uncle's with an Edsel. White wall tires, moon hubcaps, and that distinctive front grill, it was something to behold. He was known in town as "That fool that bought an Edsel."
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I found these two videos that describe the history of the 6P3S transmitter design, the one shown in that schematic. It is is Russian, but if you set the video to auto-translate captions you can kind of get the idea.
Video 1: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fbcFeBr9GIY
Video 2: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MG5BF4iQXmc
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This is the most popular transmitter design used by these stations (I think this is it anyway).
The text on the top states " УКВ приставка", meaning "FM add-on", the thingie allowing to receive FM broadcast (OIRT FM those times) on AM-only device. It was quite useful and somewhat popular gadget, since at the moment FM broadcasting started there, many people already had AM receivers - that oldschool ones, all wood and metal, often combined with vinyl player (this type was named радиола)
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This is the most popular transmitter design used by these stations (I think this is it anyway).
The text on the top states " УКВ приставка", meaning "FM add-on", the thingie allowing to receive FM broadcast (OIRT FM those times) on AM-only device. It was quite useful and somewhat popular gadget, since at the moment FM broadcasting started there, many people already had AM receivers - that oldschool ones, all wood and metal, often combined with vinyl player (this type was named радиола)
Looks like I had the wrong schematic :(
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well, these things were kind of capable of transmission - essentially they were demodulating FM and modulating it to AM. Put somewhat more beefy tube as "finals", string up something resembling an antenna and viola, AM transmitter.
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An ordinary citizen had to apply for a permit to buy a TV or radio
no, it is just scaretale. Soviets was not that bad. And seriously, why need a permit to access 100% government-owned media censored to the roots?
it took months
maybe for some devices, as production was often lacking. Btw because of said lack of production volumes there were written queues for the applicants to reserve wanted device, which may be confused for "permit".
up to a year's salary to buy one.
may be for the top-line devices, but in general no. Mostly the tube-era receivers werent cost more than 1-2 monthly salary, and many were significantly less than 1.
but the parts themselves were hard to source until late USSR, true. When the semiconductor industry finally succeded (it was long and painful struggle with the quality, some early transistors were around 90% defective), outdated tubes became easier to get. Nowadays the tubes as a final amplifiers are popular between makers because of their durability and forgiveness to design and operating flaws - it takes significant effort to kill the tube like ГУ-50 or ГУ-81. And there is a large aftermarket having metric tons of the soviet-made tubes with reasonable prices (except nixies btw).
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Those Sovtek and Svetlana tubes sold by the thousands to US hams after the end of the Cold War.
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for those wanting to witness technical wonders of 3MHz "QSO-ers", like carrier drifts or severe off-freq operation in the net, couple of good websdrs
http://troyka.tambov.gq:8902/ , dedicated for this purpose, Tambov, LO02
http://89.113.2.111:8901/ , marked as "juligan band" on 80m band choice, Tula, KO84, near Moscow.
mostly activity starts at the evenings, around 1700-1800z.
(https://i.ibb.co/nCcVcKY/2023-01-16-21-51-48.jpg) (https://ibb.co/nCcVcKY)