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General Category => Amateur Radio => Topic started by: jasmine on June 13, 2019, 0631 UTC

Title: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: jasmine on June 13, 2019, 0631 UTC
i've only been listening to hams for a short period of time but i came across a bunch of guys insulting each other with profanity , playing recordings, making physical threats etc. one kept shouting "Bootlegger Alert! Bootlegger Alert! Violation of Part 97!" one guy kept asking "have you ever done time?"

monitored from my washinton state location. at one point a guy (WA7BZI) who said he was a monitor from seattle read a long letter he was sending to the FCC about the guys who he says have been a problem for years. weird stuff.

they're still at it as of 06:35 UTC
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: IZS4 on June 13, 2019, 1237 UTC
Yes. 75 meters can be worse than CB radio a lot of the time. I only use the low portion of 80M
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on June 13, 2019, 1247 UTC
Yes. 75 meters can be worse than CB radio a lot of the time. I only use the low portion of 80M

It's funny, I have been listening to Ch 38L lately during the openings, and it's mostly well behaved DXers. I briefly heard two OMs getting into a verbal altercation, and thought to myself "they belong on 80 meters".
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: IZS4 on June 13, 2019, 1937 UTC
Funny you should say that. I have been listening to 38 LSB also lately and noticed the majority are well behaved. It wasn't until yesterday I heard a guy from Wisconsin acting a fool. I'm not sure what he was using for equipment, but I know a Yagi and some external wattage were involved. He had one hell of a signal. Probably a ham waiting for the evening 75 meter crowd to gather and just needed something to do in the mean time.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Josh on June 13, 2019, 2101 UTC
Imagine getting a license and all that equipment, placing towers and/or antennas, then using all that effort and outlay to embarrass yourself.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: IZS4 on June 13, 2019, 2214 UTC
Yeah. I remember back in the early 90's working 27.375-27.999 a lot of guys were running Icoms, Yaesu's and Kenwoods on huge towers, big Yagi's and modified ham linear's along with $1200.00 rotators. Admittedly the were obviously better than the run of the mill cobra or midland, however its quite an investment to only utilize a very small amount of spectrum.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Josh on June 13, 2019, 2325 UTC
Yeah. I remember back in the early 90's working 27.375-27.999 a lot of guys were running Icoms, Yaesu's and Kenwoods on huge towers, big Yagi's and modified ham linear's along with $1200.00 rotators. Admittedly the were obviously better than the run of the mill cobra or midland, however its quite an investment to only utilize a very small amount of spectrum.

What I meant is for some HAM to put in all the time, effort, and expense, and use it only to be an ass on the air.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: IZS4 on June 13, 2019, 2352 UTC
Yes Josh I see what you were saying after rereading your post. I was experiencing a brief period of oxygen not getting to my brain and went off course . You are absolutely right. It's a of very expensive and time wasting investment to troll people via RF.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: IZS4 on June 14, 2019, 0024 UTC
Damn it.. I did it again... Note to self. Only Five beers before posting and not Six.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: i_hear_you on June 14, 2019, 1654 UTC
I was listening to 5830 early this morning around 0500 UTC and as it faded out, I switched to 80m to make sure it wasn't my radio or antenna, and caught these jackalopes on 3860.  When I see mental illness on the sidewalks in downtown Chicago I shrug it off as sad but harmless.  However, I find something dark and sinister about such insanity paired with the financial resources and intelligence to get on-air recordings, edited in near-realtime, booming out with a huge signal on 80m for the sake of...I suppose just being noticed.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: MDK2 on June 16, 2019, 2254 UTC
As bad as 3840 LSB can get (and I have a particular interest in this one because one of the regulars, KØAXE, is only about 28 miles from me as the crow flies - I wonder if I'll ever run into him at the local HRO or any ham gathering in town), I have to say that it amazes me that W6WBJ is still on the air with a license now 12 years expired, which the FCC won't renew, but which he can keep using because he's apparently a skilled enough attorney to keep the appeals going. His determination to jam the WARFA net on 3908 with some of the worst garbage you've heard on the ham bands is a measure of both determination and profound mental disturbances. Probably one and the same with this loon.

I've heard him live on 3840 a couple of times. He's with his kind of people there.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: ThaDood on June 17, 2019, 0338 UTC
This is another reason I like 2M and 432 SSB. You just didn't hear the nasties, like you are on 75 - 80M, 40M, and even 20M. Oh, and for decades 10M has had its come and goes with weirdness, albeit it seems better up there, lately. Thus far, 17M, 12M, 6M, and 60M, seem pretty tranquil. And, I hope that it stays that way. Hey... There's always 222MHz to get back to. 222.100MHz SSB transverters anyone?
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: shadypyro on July 02, 2019, 0457 UTC
Haven't been able to get them up my way due to propagation conditions
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: jasmine on August 14, 2019, 0443 UTC
they're at it again.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Josh on August 14, 2019, 1903 UTC
There's even a 440 repeater in socal that carries much the same bunch with the same repertoire. Can't recall the freq but they're famous for having fcc investigations and so on.

You have a vfo, roll it somewhere else lest you become tainted.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: NJQA on August 16, 2019, 1254 UTC
Sadly, this type of behavior goes way back.

http://forum.near-fest.com/index.php?topic=1030.0

Someone once told me that the local hams liked having the one repeater being a “waterhole” for these cretins....it kept them off of all the other repeaters.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: XmasScotty on August 31, 2019, 2208 UTC
Me thinks they call it the "Renegade" repeater. You can pick it up on the police scanner apps for phones. I could only take about 5 minutes worth, then I turned it off. The local CB channel wars of the late 80's and early 90's were more mature than those guys.


Xmas
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: thecolonel on October 19, 2019, 0531 UTC
This crap has been part of the amateur radio subculture for as long as I can remember which is the 1980s when I started listening to shortwave radio and by extension amateur radio. This goes back actually further into the 1970s but I was only a young snot back then when there was a fair share of lids and assorted morons on HF from what I have been told. I came to age around the time that the famous 3894.5/3898/3901/14313 khz radio wars were going strong during the late 1980s early 1990s or at least to where I was getting close to graduating HS etc. I remember the first time hearing this crap was on a DX-440 Radio Shack receiver aka Sangean ATS-803 build with a Rat Shack label on it.

Back in those days you had Big "Al" Abernethy K4OKA versus "Porkbutt" Rich Whiten that had daily and nightly disputes on the middle of the 75 meter band around 3894.5 to 3901 with the poor guys on 3898 in the middle. Actually some of the material that people came up with actually quite funny including the famous "Porkbutt" song or Rich Whiten in response referring to the guys on 3894.5 as White Trash in America home of losers, boozers, bigots, etc. This also carried onto the 14.313 frequency on the 20 meter band back then and some of those alligators are still around although many of them have passed on and a new crop of lesser intelligent cretins took over. I won't name any names of the current morons but its some of the same old cast like Dumb Donnie, Jimmy O'Brainless, Fred, Detective Tom the ex-cop that got a big fine back a couple of years ago and others.

The old 3894.5/390/14313 had people like Rambo Dan, Porkbutt, Oris, Gerry, Pigpen Pete, Rube and Bill Irwin who got busted by the FCC for jamming under the moniker Raincoat Charlie, etc and then the other side was Airplane Bob TR, Jimmy Dale Polly Parrot, Billy Jack, Dumb Donnie, Jimmy O'Brainless Frankie the unlicensed operator, Big Al (his grandfather) who gave him the equipment to jam. It was a cacophony of jamming in double sideband since K4OKA opened up his FT-1000 MP and was using as much as 10,000 watts to beam his Porkbutt song all over 75 meters along with music, jamming tapes, rants, and various participants going at each other.

So in essence nothing has really changed only participants and maybe worse language than what was heard during the 1980s to mid 2000s on 75 meters and by extension 20 meters. In fact, now I think its actually spread more since 7200 khz is sometimes a real foul place to hang out along with the 3840 groups and of course 14.313 still has some of the same morons or new ones coming to age and most of them are retiring or getting older with more time on their hands to stir the pot.

If you had been there in the 1988 to 2005 time frame you would have been amazed at the trouble these guys in many cases went to in order to jam and create mayhem on 75 meters. It did finally calm down some when K4OKA got off the air and Porkbutt WB2OTK turned in his license but eventually even the miscreants came back and of course the rantings of an unnamed Western Canada stations on 20 meters contributed to the problem.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: thecolonel on October 19, 2019, 0545 UTC
Riley Hollingsworth was a bit of a stabilizing influence but even he couldn't totally clean up the mess on 75 meters and 20 meters because he was still dealing with the aforementioned characters along with Glenn B who was running a daily news net on 14.275 and breaking various FCC rules. Laura Smith didn't really fare any better and if she is still in the fray she has done next to nothing on 3.840 and thereabouts. Some other frequencies that were wild back in the day was 3843, 3853, 3865 but many of those participants and others are gone now as well or well advanced in age since most of them were in their 40s and 50s during the 1980s and 1990s.

As far as the current crop goes, its been a problem going on several years with that frequency of 3.843 and there seems to be a bunch of largely Western US stations mostly in the 6 and 7 call areas that are usually cussing each other out. At least one good thing comes out of that is that as long as they all get drunk and stupid they can stay on there and make a mess of one frequency instead of the whole band. That gives real amateur operators that take their privileges seriously the rest of the area from 3600 to 4000 and use it accordingly without needing to get involved with the 3843 mess.

Every once in a while the FCC sends out a nice big fine to someone that is flagrantly violating the rules and regulations but even so there are far more rulebreakers than US Marshals to collect the equipment with FCC agents so they send out NALs first and then might take action later. Much of the time they don't collect on the NAL because of the operator pleading poverty or its not always worth the hassle or trouble or the courts etc. The Feces aka FCC is much more interested in chasing down FM pirates in various states that often aren't a major problem only with the exception of they cut into the profit margins of the local government approved stations and we all know that IHeart media and Clear Channel, Entercomm, Cumulus, Emmis and the like. That's generally the only real reason the Feces goes after FM pirates unless they are running a dirty signal and throwing spurious emissions into the FM band and Air Band from 108 to 137 Mhz.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Josh on October 19, 2019, 2021 UTC
My gf at the time hated HAM radio to a great degree, one night she heard the shenanigans ongoing 3898 and laughed her ass off with me, then she understood at least some of the endearment of HAM radio and the various personalities involved. I have a vid of the original artist singing the porkbutt song somewhere, will have to dig it up and post.


Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Josh on October 21, 2019, 0652 UTC
porkbutt song by composer;
http://s000.tinyupload.com/index.php?file_id=71361164497431017604
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Rizla on October 30, 2019, 0225 UTC
"My gf at the time hated HAM radio to a great degree, one night she heard the shenanigans ongoing 3898 and laughed her ass off with me, then she understood at least some of the endearment of HAM radio and the various personalities involved. "

I've had the same thing happen to me ;-)

Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Token on November 01, 2019, 2132 UTC
There's even a 440 repeater in socal that carries much the same bunch with the same repertoire. Can't recall the freq but they're famous for having fcc investigations and so on.

You have a vfo, roll it somewhere else lest you become tainted.

I don't know about 440, but the 147.435 is a long standing generator of complaints.

And while there are definitely some illegal things that go on, you have to remember that some things you hear are bad form, inconsiderate, childish, crude, and unpleasant...but not illegal.

T!
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Rizla on November 02, 2019, 2146 UTC
"As far as the current crop goes, its been a problem going on several years with that frequency of 3.843..."

Colonel, thanks so much for the radio history, some great stories there.

I heard someone (maybe K0AX?) on 3840 say that ten plus years ago, Art Bell was known to hang out on 3840, in the saloon.

But as you say it goes way further back.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Josh on November 02, 2019, 2241 UTC
On the Glenn B deal, I supported him.
If the a double ar el can do it why can't someone else?
This is called selective enforcement and is against the law.

If someone's on the arrl cw (or fsk) freq before it fires up, too bad so sad, the arrl will not be stopped by mere courtesy, those kw will fly forth regardless.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Charlie_Dont_Surf on March 14, 2020, 0259 UTC
There's even a 440 repeater in socal that carries much the same bunch with the same repertoire. Can't recall the freq but they're famous for having fcc investigations and so on.

K6MWT: 147.435 (output), 146.400 MHz (input), 103.5 PL tone.

https://your435.com/about/ (https://your435.com/about/)

Quote
The Southern California 147.435 FM repeater (435) is famous for lively discussion on controversial subjects.
- Though to me it just sounds like a bunch of people calling each other names most of the time.

You can listen here: https://www.broadcastify.com/listen/feed/14747/web (https://www.broadcastify.com/listen/feed/14747/web)
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Charlie_Dont_Surf on March 14, 2020, 0324 UTC
As bad as 3840 LSB can get (and I have a particular interest in this one because one of the regulars, KØAXE, is only about 28 miles from me as the crow flies - I wonder if I'll ever run into him at the local HRO or any ham gathering in town), I have to say that it amazes me that W6WBJ is still on the air with a license now 12 years expired, which the FCC won't renew, but which he can keep using because he's apparently a skilled enough attorney to keep the appeals going. His determination to jam the WARFA net on 3908 with some of the worst garbage you've heard on the ham bands is a measure of both determination and profound mental disturbances. Probably one and the same with this loon.

I've heard him live on 3840 a couple of times. He's with his kind of people there.

W6WBJ recently was finally, finally denied his appeal of of the rejection of his 2007 (?!!) license renewal. (http://www.arrl.org/news/fcc-turns-down-amateur-licensee-s-appeal (http://www.arrl.org/news/fcc-turns-down-amateur-licensee-s-appeal)) However, they have not, the last time I checked, canceled his license. So he continues to operate, jam the WARFA net, etc.

It's incredible to me that someone has so little going on in their life and is so petty that they feel the need to attempt to jam every occurrence of a net (3x/week), for years on end, non-stop. But that's ham radio...where introverts with no social skills end up.

As for the rest of the 3840 KHz crew, it seems like that frequency has been more quiet in the last year or so, though I don't check too often so I will admit to some ignorance. Once people started to jam that frequency with recordings on a daily basis, the regulars (NO6EL, KK6FR, K0AXE, et al.) have found other places to be, apparently.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: MDK2 on March 15, 2020, 2318 UTC
W6WBJ recently was finally, finally denied his appeal of of the rejection of his 2007 (?!!) license renewal. (http://www.arrl.org/news/fcc-turns-down-amateur-licensee-s-appeal (http://www.arrl.org/news/fcc-turns-down-amateur-licensee-s-appeal)) However, they have not, the last time I checked, canceled his license. So he continues to operate, jam the WARFA net, etc.

It's incredible to me that someone has so little going on in their life and is so petty that they feel the need to attempt to jam every occurrence of a net (3x/week), for years on end, non-stop. But that's ham radio...where introverts with no social skills end up.

As for the rest of the 3840 KHz crew, it seems like that frequency has been more quiet in the last year or so, though I don't check too often so I will admit to some ignorance. Once people started to jam that frequency with recordings on a daily basis, the regulars (NO6EL, KK6FR, K0AXE, et al.) have found other places to be, apparently.

In the case of W6WBJ, I think we have a common sociopath. Nothing more, nothing less. Thanks for that link BTW, I had missed that notice. As for the others you're probably right, but I don't know if they've reconvened as I haven't found them all at one place - not that I'm really looking but I figure I'll probably stumble across KØAXE at some point since he has a big signal into my QTH.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Charlie_Dont_Surf on March 31, 2020, 1917 UTC
There's even a 440 repeater in socal that carries much the same bunch with the same repertoire. Can't recall the freq but they're famous for having fcc investigations and so on.

K6MWT: 147.435 (output), 146.400 MHz (input), 103.5 PL tone.

https://your435.com/about/ (https://your435.com/about/)

Whoops. I was looking at the thread again just now and realized that I replied to a 440 repeater inquiry with a 2 meter answer. DUH.

In any case, on the same peak (Santiago Peak in southern Orange County), there is a 446.64 ( - offset, 77.0 PL tone) repeater that has, let's say, similar clientele. Not nearly as out of control as K6MWT - not even in the same universe - but similar.
Title: Re: 3840 khz Bootlegger Net & Jammers (LSB) 05:30 UTC
Post by: Charlie_Dont_Surf on March 31, 2020, 2003 UTC
In the case of W6WBJ, I think we have a common sociopath. Nothing more, nothing less.

Good point.

As for the others you're probably right, but I don't know if they've reconvened as I haven't found them all at one place - not that I'm really looking

I've been checking a bit more often since I posted about this earlier. WA7BZI and some of the others seem to show up a lot but mostly it's people playing editing recordings of the other former regulars, including the bootleggers. Most of the regulars are still listening though and you can hear them drop a comment in here and there.

[Side note: one of the main retorts to the bootleggers has been, "Do you have a callsign?" However, it's not like the regulars, who are acting all high and mighty by asking that question, adhere to the rules about identification either. They dip in and dip out without identifying. You can listen for hours on that frequency and not hear them identify.]

A year ago or more, the other regulars got sick of the frequency and ended up on the extra-class portion of 80 meters (until the jammers found them there too) but also sometimes 160 meters. They don't seem to be doing that anymore, at least recently anyway.