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Technical Topics => SDR - Software Defined Radio => Topic started by: East Troy Don on February 09, 2020, 2003 UTC

Title: SDR recommendation......
Post by: East Troy Don on February 09, 2020, 2003 UTC
....for an SDR compatible with MAC BOOK AIR running MAC OS HIGH SIERRA Version 10.13.6.  Just doing a little research there seems to be an extraordinary amount of problems with SDR/MAC capability.  I'm looking in the $200-$300 Range.
Thanks.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: Matt285 on February 09, 2020, 2006 UTC
I'm certain Chris will have an answer to this.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: JCMaxwell on February 09, 2020, 2018 UTC
https://airspy.com/airspy-hf-discovery (https://airspy.com/airspy-hf-discovery)

https://blackcatsystems.com/software/airspyhf_macos_server.html (https://blackcatsystems.com/software/airspyhf_macos_server.html)

https://fyngyrz.com/?page_id=995 (https://fyngyrz.com/?page_id=995)

This combination will work for you.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on February 10, 2020, 2121 UTC
I would strongly suggest getting an AFEDRI SDR, as it will work native with SdrDx on the Mac, and no need for special server software, even stuff I write  :)

I have an AFE822x, and it is a solid performer. It has dual RF inputs, and you can do phasing of MW stations right inside SdrDx.  Plus it is a direct sampling SDR, so no wonky issues with images due to a tuner IC and AGC.  Note it is a 0-30 MHz SDR, and does not do VHF/UHF.  I would say it is my most sensitive SDR, it picks up the weak pirate on 1620 AM, located a few miles away, when others won't.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: East Troy Don on February 11, 2020, 0221 UTC
Thanks for the input guys, its greatly appreciated.   
Chris, which antenna does you recommend for this SDR ?
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: JCMaxwell on February 11, 2020, 0226 UTC
Chris may disagree, but if you don’t want to add another antenna, it should work well with your swl sloper.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on February 11, 2020, 1116 UTC
Chris, which antenna does you recommend for this SDR ?

Your choice of antenna is more about what you have the space/ability to install vs the radio/SDR type. Maybe describe what environment (size of land, tree's (height and spacing), etc) you have and what you're most interested in listening to?
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: East Troy Don on February 12, 2020, 0211 UTC
5 acres of Southern Wisconsin farmland.   Nearest city of any size is 15 miles away.  Very tall trees about 30 yards away, thickly spaced and VERY malleable under even light to moderate winds. Although I try to stay active I'm 69 years old and I'm not climbing them suckers.  I DO have a Whistler WS 1098  scanner than i run off of an old TV directional antenna up in the attic (it was here when I bought the house) than works beautifully picking up the 5 surrounding counties due, in no small part because the house is on top of a hill.  Since that works so well I was toying with the idea of running the SDR through a 100' bare wire antenna kit I bought a year ago and have not done anything with.  I figured as long as I don't double back over the wire layout this may work.  My shack is in an exposed ,finished  basement.  Is this a viable possibility?
Thanks.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: Josh on February 12, 2020, 2001 UTC
5 acres of Southern Wisconsin farmland?!?







I'd head straight for the rhombic rosette and/or a wullenweber!
https://www.hilomast.com/antenna-systems/hf-antennas/rhombic-antenna/
https://ece.illinois.edu/about/history/wullenweber.asp


If afraid of heights one might consider a rosette of beverages.
https://www.w8ji.com/beverages.htm
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: nickcarr3151 on February 12, 2020, 2003 UTC
5 acres of Southern Wisconsin farmland.   Nearest city of any size is 15 miles away.  I was toying with the idea of running the SDR through a 100' bare wire antenna kit.  Is this a viable possibility?

For receive just about anything is possible.  With that kind of land I'd strongly suggest a 1m amplified loop (or your own custom loop) into the Afedri. You should get mega-signals with that setup.  The random wire antenna would still work for a cheap, temporary solution.  The nice thing about the loop is that it just needs space.  It doesn't require height.  The cost is modest.  There's one from China that is like $50 online.  There's a USA-made model called W6LVP Loop and it's around $250.  Then there's Wellbrook but they're a tad more expensive.

W6LVP:  https://www.w6lvp.com/product/amplified-receive-only-mag-loop-antenna-with-power-inserter/
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on February 12, 2020, 2055 UTC
I'm a big fan of passive antennas over active. For general purpose receive, a sky loop is hard to beat. That's my primary HF antenna. I'll let my logs speak for themselves :)

You have plenty of room. It doesn't need to be very high anything from 20 to 50 ft is fine. Exact dimensions are not critical.  So you don't need to climb trees, just launch some ropes over branches in various locations. Feed with a 4:1 balun and coax antenna. Done.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: nickcarr3151 on February 12, 2020, 2117 UTC
I'm a big fan of passive antennas over active. For general purpose receive, a sky loop is hard to beat.

If it's so good then why do you have 17 antennas?  ;)

I have two HF antennas. One is for Rx and the other is for Tx.  My Rx loop is about 60m but hey no one is perfect. :D
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on February 12, 2020, 2215 UTC
I'm a big fan of passive antennas over active. For general purpose receive, a sky loop is hard to beat.

If it's so good then why do you have 17 antennas?  ;)

Band specific antennas always work best. But the sky loop is an excellent performer overall.

Plus I've also got about 17 receivers  :)
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: NJQA on February 13, 2020, 1245 UTC
I'm a big fan of passive antennas over active. For general purpose receive, a sky loop is hard to beat.

If it's so good then why do you have 17 antennas?  ;)

I have two HF antennas. One is for Rx and the other is for Tx.  My Rx loop is about 60m but hey no one is perfect. :D

All practical antennas have nulls and lobes.  The DX is always in a null on the antenna you are using.  Having choices means another one might have the DX in a lobe.

You can never have enough antennas.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: East Troy Don on February 13, 2020, 1427 UTC
Lots to digest and research here - Wonderful stuff guys and thanks again.

Don
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: JCMaxwell on February 13, 2020, 1434 UTC
Another suggestion, build a T2FD, fun to build and they pick up great.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on February 13, 2020, 1823 UTC
I'm a big fan of passive antennas over active. For general purpose receive, a sky loop is hard to beat.

If it's so good then why do you have 17 antennas?  ;)

I have two HF antennas. One is for Rx and the other is for Tx.  My Rx loop is about 60m but hey no one is perfect. :D

All practical antennas have nulls and lobes.  The DX is always in a null on the antenna you are using.  Having choices means another one might have the DX in a lobe.

You can never have enough antennas.

This.

Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: IQ_imbalance on May 13, 2020, 2350 UTC
I'll second the afedri recommendation...very happy w/ mine (it's the HF/VHF version).

With 5 acres you could set up a pair of loops and phase them....that might be fun. 
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: Rob. on May 14, 2020, 0121 UTC
Another vote for the Afedri. I use mine on a PC but really like it.

- Rob
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: alpard on August 20, 2020, 1625 UTC
There is this 16 bit SDR called RX888, and seems storming the SDR market recently.

https://swling.com/blog/2020/08/the-new-rx-888-16-bit-adc-direct-sampling-sdr-with-32-mhz-bandwidth/
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on August 20, 2020, 1710 UTC
There is this 16 bit SDR called RX888, and seems storming the SDR market recently.

https://swling.com/blog/2020/08/the-new-rx-888-16-bit-adc-direct-sampling-sdr-with-32-mhz-bandwidth/

Which software packages support it?
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: alpard on August 20, 2020, 1735 UTC
There is this 16 bit SDR called RX888, and seems storming the SDR market recently.

https://swling.com/blog/2020/08/the-new-rx-888-16-bit-adc-direct-sampling-sdr-with-32-mhz-bandwidth/

Which software packages support it?

I have no idea, because it seems a new product from China.  But reviews seems quite good, and they say 16 bit SDR is good set to go for.  Not many info about it especially regarding Software support, but I would think that the usual SDR software packages will work with it. Otherwise, no one will buy it?

Anyway interesting because someone was talking about it in the similar league as the Perseus.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: RobRich on August 22, 2020, 2221 UTC
Copied from my rely in another thread....

The RX-666 and RX-888 are similar. Both are based on the BBRF103 open-source design. The RX-888 adds an integrated LNA, plus claims of possibly a higher-precision TXCO, for around $200 to $250 from China via eBay or similar.

For HF and below, both appears to use the LTC2208.... or a clone.... or a salvage chip? The LTC2208 is 15 years old at this point, but AFAIK, it still is not a cheap IC to legitimately source new. Up to 32MHz sampling, with up to 28.8MHz alias-free sampling. USB 3.0 is required for such high sample rates.

BTW, above HF they use a common R820T2, but apparently with up to 8MHz sampling currently possible.

----------------

About software, AFAIK there is a modified version of HDSDR+EXTIO for the RX-666, plus I have seen a claim the BBRF103 project EXTIO should work. I have no idea if either supports configuring the LNA in the RX-888, though.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on August 22, 2020, 2304 UTC
For HF and below, both appears to use the LTC2208.... or a clone.... or a salvage chip? The LTC2208 is 15 years old at this point, but AFAIK, it still is not a cheap IC to legitimately source new. Up to 32MHz sampling, with up to 28.8MHz alias-free sampling. USB 3.0 is required for such high sample rates.

They seem to go for $100 or so, not a lot of price break even for qty 1,000 or 10,000 pieces. Considering the selling price of the SDRs, and all else that goes into them, as well as mfg costs (even in China), it made me wonder about their provenance. Lots of possibilities  :)
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: alpard on August 23, 2020, 1035 UTC
Too uncertain on their performance and reliability as yet?

RSP1 clones now going for about $50, and they are 14bit SDR the same spec as SDRPlay RSP1.
Safe to go with something like this? Cheap, tried and tested?
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on August 23, 2020, 1851 UTC
Too uncertain on their performance and reliability as yet?

RSP1 clones now going for about $50, and they are 14bit SDR the same spec as SDRPlay RSP1.
Safe to go with something like this? Cheap, tried and tested?

They may claim the same specs as a genuine unit, but you won't know for sure until you try it. As an example, there's lots of nanoVNA variants out there. Some of them work fine, some of them are garbage. Could be due to shoddy manufacturing, or using substandard components (lower performance variants, QA rejects, etc).  You pays your money and you takes your chances.

Also there's the consideration that they're possibly using SDRplay IP without permission.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: RobRich on August 23, 2020, 2227 UTC
Too uncertain on their performance and reliability as yet?

It could be playing the chip lottery. As Chris and I noted, the LTC2208 is not an inexpensive part. o.0

Analog Devices is large enough to likely destroy ICs failing QA testing. There is unlikely to be a "backdoor" supply chain, either.

I doubt a Chinese fab would be interested in expending the resources to clone a relatively low-demand SDR IC versus more mundane chips routinely sold in quantities of millions.

That leaves the possibility of salvage chips, for example ICs perhaps extracted from decommissioned telecom equipment.

Knowing you are unlikely to have any after-sale support, do you feel like rolling the dice? From the reviews it appears there is a decent chance of obtaining a working device, but being realistic, purchasers should go into transactions mentally prepared to burn their money. YMMV.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: alpard on August 23, 2020, 2358 UTC
Yeah, I will stick to my good old cheap analogue radios for another year or two, while the market settles for more certainty, and the price will drop for another 50%. :D

Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: Ray Lalleu on August 26, 2020, 2154 UTC
5 acres of Southern Wisconsin farmland.  ...
 the house is on top of a hill.
Use low dipole on any slope of the hill facing a direction you want to hear. And maybe the lines to the dipoles can act as SW Beverages ?
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: alpard on August 27, 2020, 1901 UTC
The 16bit SDR RX666 and RX888 were quite impressive with 32Mhz reception on SW.

They sounded like FM quality reception on SW.
It looks worthwhile that we keep watching how they actually compare and perform.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: Ray Lalleu on August 28, 2020, 0824 UTC
There is this 16 bit SDR called RX888, and seems storming the SDR market recently.

https://swling.com/blog/2020/08/the-new-rx-888-16-bit-adc-direct-sampling-sdr-with-32-mhz-bandwidth/

Which software packages support it?

I have no idea, because it seems a new product from China. [....]

On swling, you can see a HDSDR screen (with RX888 control box).
On eBay, 'HDSDR' is in the product title and is mentioned in the detailed description as made compatible with the RX888 (waiting for other SDR software)
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: NJQA on September 06, 2020, 1455 UTC
Copied from my rely in another thread....

The RX-666 and RX-888 are similar. Both are based on the BBRF103 open-source design. The RX-888 adds an integrated LNA, plus claims of possibly a higher-precision TXCO, for around $200 to $250 from China via eBay or similar.

For HF and below, both appears to use the LTC2208.... or a clone.... or a salvage chip? The LTC2208 is 15 years old at this point, but AFAIK, it still is not a cheap IC to legitimately source new. Up to 32MHz sampling, with up to 28.8MHz alias-free sampling. USB 3.0 is required for such high sample rates.

BTW, above HF they use a common R820T2, but apparently with up to 8MHz sampling currently possible.

----------------

About software, AFAIK there is a modified version of HDSDR+EXTIO for the RX-666, plus I have seen a claim the BBRF103 project EXTIO should work. I have no idea if either supports configuring the LNA in the RX-888, though.

More:
https://dk8ok.org/2020/09/04/rx-888-32-mhz-16bit-200-us-pricks-up-your-ears/

This is starting to look interesting.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: RobRich on September 06, 2020, 2202 UTC
My personal interest still remains where the LTC2208 chip is being sourced to build a ~$200 SDR. o.0

Dynamic range aside, I am somewhat curious about image rejection and selectivity when trying to simultaneously sample ~32MHz of RF space with a SDR architecture designed to generate profit at a ~$200 price point, especially when a huge chunk of the production budget theoretically should be the LTC2208 chip alone.

Also I would consider VHF and above simply as an added bonus given those ranges are using a R820T2 chip, so up there think more along the lines of a RTL-SDR with a higher sampling rate via the USB 3 interface.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: Jari Finland on October 09, 2020, 1455 UTC
Since yesterday I have been an owner of RX-888. How proud, remains to be seen. Next comes, perhaps sooner than later, a real test and comparison with Perseus using 500-800 metres long beverages.

I wouldn't be so shocked about LTC2208. For example Digikey gives retail price of 100 USD or less.
https://www.digikey.com/en/products/filter/data-acquisition-analog-to-digital-converters-adc/700?s=N4IgTCBcDaIDIBUDCYwAYAcIC6BfIA (https://www.digikey.com/en/products/filter/data-acquisition-analog-to-digital-converters-adc/700?s=N4IgTCBcDaIDIBUDCYwAYAcIC6BfIA)

I can imagine a Chinese factory selling these straight from the line to another Chinese factory for half a price or less. You can construct a 200 USD SDR with that and make a little profit.

Personally I am curious about who is actually making these. We have now several SDR receivers designed and manufactured by hams: Belka, Malakhit. And this Chinese copy of Italian BBRF103.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: ChrisSmolinski on October 09, 2020, 1500 UTC
I bit the bullet, and have a RX-888 on the way as well. Not sure when the slow boat from China will arrive, probably not for a few weeks. I'll report back with some test results when it does arrive.
Title: Re: SDR recommendation......
Post by: Jari Finland on October 09, 2020, 1527 UTC
Not sure when the slow boat from China will arrive

Mine was resting in Shenzhen for one full month before it began moving anywhere.